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vgsingh
12-06-2012, 06:45 AM
Sir


I joined Ministry in the year 1988 in the pay scale of 1400-2300 and worked there upto Nov.1993. During this period a post in the payscale of 1600-2660 was advertised in the same ministry. I applied for it and got selected. I thereafter joined this post in nov 1993 after the technical resignation tendered by me got accepted. Thereafter I got only one promotion. I had already got 1 ACP,

As I had already completed 20. Years of service (2012-1988=24) am I eligible to get 2nd MACP. Please advise

Victor
12-06-2012, 09:42 AM
Sir


I joined Ministry in the year 1988 in the pay scale of 1400-2300 and worked there upto Nov.1993. During this period a post in the payscale of 1600-2660 was advertised in the same ministry. I applied for it and got selected. I thereafter joined this post in nov 1993 after the technical resignation tendered by me got accepted. Thereafter I got only one promotion. I had already got 1 ACP,

As I had already completed 20. Years of service (2012-1988=24) am I eligible to get 2nd MACP. Please advise

Your Regular Service for the purpose of MACP would count from Nov 1993 as you joined in a higher scale which now carries higher GP. Hence, you will be due for 2nd MACP on completion of 20 years of service (i.e. in Nov 2013) or on completion of 10 years of service in the same GP, whichever is earlier.

Victor

vgsingh
13-06-2012, 10:46 AM
Your Regular Service for the purpose of MACP would count from Nov 1993 as you joined in a higher scale which now carries higher GP. Hence, you will be due for 2nd MACP on completion of 20 years of service (i.e. in Nov 2013) or on completion of 10 years of service in the same GP, whichever is earlier.

Victor

But as per Order NO. 11/1/2010-JCA,of Ministry of Personnel , Public Grievances and Pensions, Department of Personnel & Training (UCA Section) dated 6th Oct.,2010 at Item NO. 16 on page 13 it has been stated that "However, in case of
Technical Resignations, the past service shall be counted for the purpose of MACP".

Pl clarify

Victor
13-06-2012, 03:07 PM
But as per Order NO. 11/1/2010-JCA,of Ministry of Personnel , Public Grievances and Pensions, Department of Personnel & Training (UCA Section) dated 6th Oct.,2010 at Item NO. 16 on page 13 it has been stated that "However, in case of
Technical Resignations, the past service shall be counted for the purpose of MACP".

Pl clarify

The complete case details of Item 16 are not available and hence cannot be commented upon.

However, your case will be covered under Item 14.

Further, the reference indicated are only minutes of a meeting and is not an Order.

Victor

vgsingh
15-06-2012, 04:45 PM
The complete case details of Item 16 are not available and hence cannot be commented upon.

However, your case will be covered under Item 14.

Further, the reference indicated are only minutes of a meeting and is not an Order.

Victor

Thanks Mr. Victor.
The indicated reference is a Record Note of the Second Meeting of the Joint Committee on MACPS held under the Chairmanship of the Joint Secretary(E), DOPT on 15th September, 2010. This was a govt decision that, in case of
Technical Resignations, the past service
shall be counted for the purpose of MACP. Can this be taken equivalent to order?

In the above scenario what should be my future course of action?
Should I represent?

Please suggest.

thanks

Victor
15-06-2012, 11:27 PM
Thanks Mr. Victor.
The indicated reference is a Record Note of the Second Meeting of the Joint Committee on MACPS held under the Chairmanship of the Joint Secretary(E), DOPT on 15th September, 2010. This was a govt decision that, in case of
Technical Resignations, the past service
shall be counted for the purpose of MACP. Can this be taken equivalent to order?

In the above scenario what should be my future course of action?
Should I represent?

Please suggest.

thanks

I again reteirate what I said ealier.

The complete case details of Item 16 are not available and hence cannot be equated with your case.

Your case is suitably covered under Item 14 and the discussions on this item are self explanatory. Also refer to para 9 of Annexure-I of MACP Scheme (http://circulars.nic.in/WriteReadData/CircularPortal/D2/D02est/35034_3_2008-Estt.(D).pdf) in this regard.

Further, any recommendations of a Committee are subject to acceptance by the competent authority and is conveyed by issuing suitable communicatons.

Victor

Ramnath
16-06-2012, 07:59 AM
Mr.Singh,
I place below my opinion.
You were working in the Pay Scale staring at Rs.1400/-. Got selected to post with pay scale Rs.1600/- & joined the same on technical resignation.

If you had joined in the post carrying same Rs.1400 basic again in Nov 1993 (even on competive examination as fresh recruit), then your MACP will start from your 1st appointment in the 1400 scale from 1988. For same scale of post, even technical resignation is taken into account and your MACP will start from the year 1988 itself for counting of 10th/20th/30th year from 1988.

But, you joined a higher post on appointment again. Hence, you will be getting MACP from Nov 1993 on joining 1600 Basic.

This is my view, which I feel is correct.

I think, only if you join as a departmental candidate on promotion (competitive examination), then, your appointment in 1600 will not be counted as fresh recruit and your MACP will start counting since 1988 itself.

Mr.Victor, am I right with regard to my last para?

Awaiting your opinion please.
Ramnath

Victor
16-06-2012, 01:03 PM
Mr.Singh,
I place below my opinion.
You were working in the Pay Scale staring at Rs.1400/-. Got selected to post with pay scale Rs.1600/- & joined the same on technical resignation.

If you had joined in the post carrying same Rs.1400 basic again in Nov 1993 (even on competive examination as fresh recruit), then your MACP will start from your 1st appointment in the 1400 scale from 1988. For same scale of post, even technical resignation is taken into account and your MACP will start from the year 1988 itself for counting of 10th/20th/30th year from 1988.

But, you joined a higher post on appointment again. Hence, you will be getting MACP from Nov 1993 on joining 1600 Basic.

This is my view, which I feel is correct.

I think, only if you join as a departmental candidate on promotion (competitive examination), then, your appointment in 1600 will not be counted as fresh recruit and your MACP will start counting since 1988 itself.

Mr.Victor, am I right with regard to my last para?

Awaiting your opinion please.
Ramnath

Yes you are right. Regular Service for the purpose of MACP Scheme starts from the date of joining a post on direct recruitment basis. On promotion the service is not reset. If the govt servant resigns and joins another post (with higher GP) as a direct recruit, then the service is reset. Past service in the same GP would be counted for MACP.

Victor

vgsingh
16-06-2012, 08:14 PM
Yes you are right. Regular Service for the purpose of MACP Scheme starts from the date of joining a post on direct recruitment basis. On promotion the service is not reset. If the govt servant resigns and joins another post (with higher GP) as a direct recruit, then the service is reset. Past service in the same GP would be counted for MACP.

Victor

Respected senior members Mr. Victor and Mr. Ramnath

Thanks for taking pain to reply my query.
As pointed by Mr. Ramnath I wishes to clarify that
YES I applied as Departmental Candidate when I applied for the post in the pay scale of Rs. 1600-2660 and also got selected as departmental candidate as the post WAS IN THE SAME MINISTRY . In that case I think I my MACP eligibility will start counting from 1988. My appointment in the scale of 1600-2660 was not a fresh recruitment. My previous service book (that of Rs.1400-2300) and other service records were also transferred.
in the current seniority list my date of joining govt service has been stated as 23-12-1988.
I request the senior members Mr. Victor and Mr. Ramnath to further guide me as my knowledge of service matters is that of Nursery student.

With Kind regards
VG

vgsingh
18-06-2012, 10:19 AM
Respected senior members Mr. Victor and Mr. Ramnath

Thanks for taking pain to reply my query.
As pointed by Mr. Ramnath I wishes to clarify that
YES I applied as Departmental Candidate when I applied for the post in the pay scale of Rs. 1600-2660 and also got selected as departmental candidate as the post WAS IN THE SAME MINISTRY . In that case I think I my MACP eligibility will start counting from 1988. My appointment in the scale of 1600-2660 was not a fresh recruitment. My previous service book (that of Rs.1400-2300) and other service records were also transferred.
in the current seniority list my date of joining govt service has been stated as 23-12-1988.
I request the senior members Mr. Victor and Mr. Ramnath to further guide me as my knowledge of service matters is that of Nursery student.

With Kind regards
VG

I once again requests the senior members Mr. Victor and Mr. Ramnath to further guide

Thanks

vgsingh
21-06-2012, 06:05 AM
I once again requests the senior members Mr. Victor and Mr. Ramnath to further guide

Thanks

Sir
I am waitig for Mr Victor's reoly but I think he is not intested.. Any how thnks for yours suggestions. I will always be grateful to you.

I request all members to share their views with me.


Thanks

Vg.

Victor
21-06-2012, 10:22 AM
Sir
I am waitig for Mr Victor's reoly but I think he is not intested.. Any how thnks for yours suggestions. I will always be grateful to you.

I request all members to share their views with me.


Thanks

Vg.

The fact that you had to submit a technical resignation to join a higher post proves that you joined the higher post as a direct recruit. Hence, your regular service for the purpose of MACP will start from the date of joining the higher post.

Whether the higher post is in the same office or a different office has no relevance. The transfer of service records was done as the resignation was "technical" and the past service is liable to be counted towards pension, leave, etc.

I have nothing further to add.

Victor

vgsingh
21-06-2012, 10:31 AM
the fact that you had to submit a technical resignation to join a higher post proves that you joined the higher post as a direct recruit. Hence, your regular service for the purpose of macp will start from the date of joining the higher post.

Whether the higher post is in the same office or a different office has no relevance. The transfer of service records was done as the resignation was "technical" and the past service is liable to be counted towards pension, leave, etc.

I have nothing further to add.

Victor

thanks a lot for your reply

gsnsarma
05-10-2012, 09:06 AM
Sir
I have joined service on 01-may-1987 in the scale of 4000-6000

I got 1st ACP of 5000-8000 w.e.f. Aug 1999

I have submitted Technical resignation to the above post and joined the same organisation
in the scale of 5500-9000 on 03 Jul 2007

am I eligible for 2nd MACP with 4600 GP w.e.f Sep 2008?

Please reply to [email protected]

Regards,
GSN Sarma
Naval dockyard
Visakhapatnam

Victor
05-10-2012, 10:14 AM
Sir
I have joined service on 01-may-1987 in the scale of 4000-6000

I got 1st ACP of 5000-8000 w.e.f. Aug 1999

I have submitted Technical resignation to the above post and joined the same organisation
in the scale of 5500-9000 on 03 Jul 2007

am I eligible for 2nd MACP with 4600 GP w.e.f Sep 2008?

Please reply to [email protected]

Regards,
GSN Sarma
Naval dockyard
Visakhapatnam

Your 'Regular Service' for the purpose of MACP will commence w.e.f. 3rd July 2007 and NO benefit of past service will be given.

Hence, your 1st MACP will be due on 3rd July 2017.

Victor

vgsingh
10-10-2012, 10:51 AM
Sir


I joined Ministry in the year 1988 in the pay scale of 1400-2300 and worked there upto Nov.1993. During this period a post in the payscale of 1600-2660 was advertised in the same ministry. I applied for it and got selected. I thereafter joined this post in nov 1993 after the technical resignation tendered by me got accepted. Thereafter I got only one promotion. I had already got 1 ACP,

As I had already completed 20. Years of service (2012-1988=24) am I eligible to get 2nd MACP. Please advise

Sir

At S.No 2(i) titled ‘Financial upqradation under MACPS in the case of staff who joined another unit/ organisation on request’ of DOPT Order No. 35034/3/2008-Estt.(D) (Vol.II) dated 4th October, 2012 it has been stated that:
“Regular service rendered in previous organisation/ office shall be counted alongwith the regular service in the new organisation/ office for the purpose of getting financial upgradations under the MACPS”
Moreover the same thing was also been stated in the DOPT Office Order Office No.35034/3/2008-Estt. (D) (Vol.II) dated the 1st November, 2010 Under para No. 2 it has been stated that:
“The issue has been examined and it is clarified that in case of transfer 'including unilateral transfer on request, regular service' rendered in previous organisation/office shall be counted alongwith the regular service in the new organisation/office for the purposes of getting financial upgradations under the MACPS”.

Will my MACP start counting from 23rd Dec.,1988 itself i.e., the date of Commencement of Govt service or not based upon the above stated orders

Mr. Victor, kindly give me yours opinion

vgsingh
12-10-2012, 09:52 AM
Sir
I joined Ministry in the year 1988 in the pay scale of 1400-2300 and worked there upto Nov.1993. During this period a post in the pay scale of 1600-2660 was advertised in the same ministry. I applied for it and got selected. I thereafter joined this post in nov 1993 after the technical resignation tendered by me got accepted. Thereafter I got only one promotion. I had already got 1 ACP,
Recently two new orders has been issued by DOPT. In this

At S.No 2(i) titled ‘Financial upqradation under MACPS in the case of staff who joined another unit/ organisation on request’ of DOPT Order No. 35034/3/2008-Estt.(D) (Vol.II) dated 4th October, 2012 it has been stated that:

“Regular service rendered in previous organisation/ office shall be counted alongwith the regular service in the new organisation/ office for the purpose of getting financial upgradations under the MACPS”

Moreover the same thing was also been stated in the DOPT Office Order Office No.35034/3/2008-Estt. (D) (Vol.II) dated the 1st November, 2010 Under para No. 2 it has been stated that:

“The issue has been examined and it is clarified that in case of transfer 'including unilateral transfer on request, regular service' rendered in previous organisation/office shall be counted alongwith the regular service in the new organisation/office for the purposes of getting financial upgradations under the MACPS”.

Based upon the above stated orders Will my MACP start counting from 23rd Dec., 1988 itself i.e., the date of joing Govt service in the pay scale of Rs. 1400-2300 or not

Please provide me yours opinion such that I can take some benefit.

Victor
12-10-2012, 11:14 AM
Sir

At S.No 2(i) titled ‘Financial upqradation under MACPS in the case of staff who joined another unit/ organisation on request’ of DOPT Order No. 35034/3/2008-Estt.(D) (Vol.II) dated 4th October, 2012 it has been stated that:
“Regular service rendered in previous organisation/ office shall be counted alongwith the regular service in the new organisation/ office for the purpose of getting financial upgradations under the MACPS”
Moreover the same thing was also been stated in the DOPT Office Order Office No.35034/3/2008-Estt. (D) (Vol.II) dated the 1st November, 2010 Under para No. 2 it has been stated that:
“The issue has been examined and it is clarified that in case of transfer 'including unilateral transfer on request, regular service' rendered in previous organisation/office shall be counted alongwith the regular service in the new organisation/office for the purposes of getting financial upgradations under the MACPS”.

Will my MACP start counting from 23rd Dec.,1988 itself i.e., the date of Commencement of Govt service or not based upon the above stated orders

Mr. Victor, kindly give me yours opinion

The OMs you are referring to have been issued in the context of para 24 of Annexure-I of the MACP Scheme (http://ccis.nic.in/WriteReadData/CircularPortal/D2/D02est/35034_3_2008-Estt.(D).pdf).

Para 24 pertains to cases where an employee after promotion/ACP seek transfer to a lower post/scale in another organisation.

Is you case covered under this para?. You may decide yourself.

Victor

RKPATHAK
13-10-2012, 06:25 AM
Your service starts w.e.f. 1988 therefore eligibility for three upgradations are 1998, 2008 & 2018. In this case MACP came w.e.f. 1.9.2008, take the status how many financial upgradations one has got. From the perusal of this case one promotion and one ACP has been granted it mean earned two upgradatons. Therefore benefit of third upgradation under MACP be granted during 2018

vgsingh
17-10-2012, 09:56 AM
Your service starts w.e.f. 1988 therefore eligibility for three upgradations are 1998, 2008 & 2018. In this case MACP came w.e.f. 1.9.2008, take the status how many financial upgradations one has got. From the perusal of this case one promotion and one ACP has been granted it mean earned two upgradatons. Therefore benefit of third upgradation under MACP be granted during 2018

sir
Thanks Mr.Pathak for your valuable comments. Further I Wish to clarify that the promotion which I got was in the same pay scale of Rs 6500- 10500 as both the posts have same pay scale & grade pay and hence cannot be treated as promotion as per 6th Pay commn (I think so.Not sure). The only difference is that the previous one is non -gazetted while the later one is Group B gazetted post. In that case please tell me whether I am eligible for 2nd up-gradation or not.

RKPATHAK
17-10-2012, 10:07 AM
As per the information provided your were initially recruited in the pay scale of Rs 1400-2600 which is the comparable to the Grade pay Rs 4200. Therefore you are eligible for atleast three financial upgradations in entire service, i.e., Grade pay Rs 4600, 4800 and 5400