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R K Rao
25-02-2010, 08:14 PM
Dear Sirs,

In Nov 2009, I had gone from here (mumbai) to Trichy by train and from Trichy to Kumbakonam by private van and from Kumbakonam to Chennai by private bus and (due to last minute change in the plan and cancellation of train ticket) from Chennai to Mumbai by Kingfisher flight.

I am entitled to travel by II AC sleeper. I had obtained permission for myself and my wife. I submitted my claim restricting it from Mumbai to Trichy and back by II AC sleeper (II AC for return journey and II class for onward journey upto Trichy). I had opted to fly back because I had seen a claim by private airlines get passed and paid to one of my colleagues (by the same kingfisher) - (Also, just for info. - my office is based in Mumbai and my pay and allowances and other claims like TA/LTC/CEA etc are pre-audited and paid by Controller of Defence Accounts, Pune).

My LTC claim was passed with TA only for onward journey (by II class). The return journey fare was not admitted stating that the same was by private vehicle and private flight.

When I pointed out the earlier case (passed in Jul 2006), I have received a reply now that the orders prohibiting flying by private airlines was issued after Jul 2006 and therefore the earlier claim was admitted and because of this, I am not entitled to it.

I have no complaints (because no use in complaining also - as the rules are rules).

But My Boss tells me that he will accord ex-post facto sanction for the flight which will allow me to claim fare by II AC (Tell me Sirs, Am I not lucky to have such a Good Commanding Officer? I am grateful to him).

This is the story so far. Now my query is -

I donot want a sanction accorded by my boss getting rejected. So,

Is there any rule/ loop hole in the LTC Rules, which will permit admission of my claim? If there is none, I shall argue with my boss not to accord any such sanction and let the case be closed (though it will be a little financial loss to me).

Additional Two questions please -

What is the difference between a post-facto sanction and an Ex-post facto sanction.

If my boss is the controlling authority for me for my TA/LTC claims, then whether he is also the competent authority to accord ex-post facto sanction or should it go to next higher level ? Similarly, if he is the competent authority to sanction an expenditure for the office, is he also the CA for according ex-post facto sanction?


Thank you all and Regards Sirs.

RKR

tvenkatam
26-02-2010, 02:17 PM
Dear Sirs,

In Nov 2009, I had gone from here (mumbai) to Trichy by train and from Trichy to Kumbakonam by private van and from Kumbakonam to Chennai by private bus and (due to last minute change in the plan and cancellation of train ticket) from Chennai to Mumbai by Kingfisher flight.

I am entitled to travel by II AC sleeper. I had obtained permission for myself and my wife. I submitted my claim restricting it from Mumbai to Trichy and back by II AC sleeper (II AC for return journey and II class for onward journey upto Trichy). I had opted to fly back because I had seen a claim by private airlines get passed and paid to one of my colleagues (by the same kingfisher) - (Also, just for info. - my office is based in Mumbai and my pay and allowances and other claims like TA/LTC/CEA etc are pre-audited and paid by Controller of Defence Accounts, Pune).

My LTC claim was passed with TA only for onward journey (by II class). The return journey fare was not admitted stating that the same was by private vehicle and private flight.

When I pointed out the earlier case (passed in Jul 2006), I have received a reply now that the orders prohibiting flying by private airlines was issued after Jul 2006 and therefore the earlier claim was admitted and because of this, I am not entitled to it.

I have no complaints (because no use in complaining also - as the rules are rules).

But My Boss tells me that he will accord ex-post facto sanction for the flight which will allow me to claim fare by II AC (Tell me Sirs, Am I not lucky to have such a Good Commanding Officer? I am grateful to him).

This is the story so far. Now my query is -

I donot want a sanction accorded by my boss getting rejected. So,

Is there any rule/ loop hole in the LTC Rules, which will permit admission of my claim? If there is none, I shall argue with my boss not to accord any such sanction and let the case be closed (though it will be a little financial loss to me).

Additional Two questions please -

What is the difference between a post-facto sanction and an Ex-post facto sanction.

If my boss is the controlling authority for me for my TA/LTC claims, then whether he is also the competent authority to accord ex-post facto sanction or should it go to next higher level ? Similarly, if he is the competent authority to sanction an expenditure for the office, is he also the CA for according ex-post facto sanction?


Thank you all and Regards Sirs.

RKR

Dear Mr. Rao,

Air journey performed subsequent to 13.07.2009 by flights other than Air India are not eligible for claim under TA rules including LTC. Any deviation or relaxation from this stipulation will require specific approval of Ministry of Civil Aviation. Your cadre controlling authority is not competent to accord exemption.

There is no difference between the terms ‘post-facto’ and ‘ex-post facto’. Approval/sanctions are usually accorded before the proposed expenditure is incurred. In cases where the expenditure already incurred is justified subsequently, the approval/sanction issued in such cases will be post-facto or ex-post facto.

R K Rao
26-02-2010, 08:30 PM
Dear Mr. Rao,

Air journey performed subsequent to 13.07.2009 by flights other than Air India are not eligible for claim under TA rules including LTC. Any deviation or relaxation from this stipulation will require specific approval of Ministry of Civil Aviation. Your cadre controlling authority is not competent to accord exemption.

There is no difference between the terms ‘post-facto’ and ‘ex-post facto’. Approval/sanctions are usually accorded before the proposed expenditure is incurred. In cases where the expenditure already incurred is justified subsequently, the approval/sanction issued in such cases will be post-facto or ex-post facto.

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Dear Sir,

Thank you for the kind explanation.

Kindly also let me know if I can take up the matter with civil aviation? Is any justification etc. is required? Since I am holding a lowly post (GP Rs. 4200), will the Civil aviation ministry entertain my application?

Lastly, in a nut a nutshell sir, Should I apply to Civil aviation? (My boss will go to any extent to help me out but I do not want to use/misuse his authority and kindness in this matter (or for any other matter for that purpose))?

Regards, Sir


RKR

tvenkatam
26-02-2010, 10:37 PM
----

Dear Sir,

Thank you for the kind explanation.

Kindly also let me know if I can take up the matter with civil aviation? Is any justification etc. is required? Since I am holding a lowly post (GP Rs. 4200), will the Civil aviation ministry entertain my application?

Lastly, in a nut a nutshell sir, Should I apply to Civil aviation? (My boss will go to any extent to help me out but I do not want to use/misuse his authority and kindness in this matter (or for any other matter for that purpose))?

Regards, Sir


RKR

Dear Mr. Rao,

Firstly it may be noted that Ministry of Civil aviation may be moved for relaxation only in cases of non-availability of services of National Airlines in the sector of journey or on the grounds of operational reasons such as cancellation/rescheduling to one’s disadvantage.

Secondly, relaxation of Ministry of Civil aviation will be appropriate only where the applicant is entitled to travel by air.

In the instant case, the existing rules of TA on LTC seemingly provide for summary rejection of the fare on return journey between Chennai-Mumbai (by private airlines).

R K Rao
26-02-2010, 11:23 PM
Dear Mr. Rao,

Firstly it may be noted that Ministry of Civil aviation may be moved for relaxation only in cases of non-availability of services of National Airlines in the sector of journey or on the grounds of operational reasons such as cancellation/rescheduling to one’s disadvantage.

Secondly, relaxation of Ministry of Civil aviation will be appropriate only where the applicant is entitled to travel by air.

In the instant case, the existing rules of TA on LTC seemingly provide for summary rejection of the fare on return journey between Chennai-Mumbai (by private airlines).

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Dear Sir,

You have cleared my confused mind with your clarification on the subject.

I had a general but vague idea on all the three points mentioned by you, above. But I wanted some knowledgeable person to spell it out before I close the case.

Thank you once again Sir and Regards

RKR