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Anthony
17-12-2009, 06:28 PM
Dear friends,

After implementation of the Sixth pay commission, does the FR-22 Rule hold good ? In Railways, a clarification has been issued that rule 1313(FR-22) still holds good even after the implementation of the Sixth pay commission.

According to FR-22, when a person has been promoted from a lower grade to a higher grade where there is assumption of higher responsibility, an increment in the lower grade should be given.

If that's so, even the promotions earned in the merged grades, where there is assumption of higher responsibility, an increment in the lower grade should be given, since there is assumption of higher responsibility. Those who are affected by this merger of grades, can quote this rule and represent to their departments.

Anthony

parimel
17-12-2009, 09:58 PM
During the discussion in the anomaly committee Item No. 5(vi)
(vi) Rule 9. Date of next increment

The Official side was of the opinion that the Revised Pay Rules will override the provisions of the Fundamental Rules.
Please see http://paycommissionupdate.blogspot.com/2009/12/national-anomaly-committee-meeting-and.html (http://paycommissionupdate.blogspot.com/2009/12/national-anomaly-committee-meeting-and.html)

So in all cases they will say Revised Pay Rules will override the provisions of the Fundamental Rules

Anthony
18-12-2009, 08:39 PM
Dear friends,
Has any one have the answer ?

Anthony

parimel
18-12-2009, 08:54 PM
Dear friends,
Has any one have the answer ?

Anthony

Revised Pay Rules will override the provisions of the Fundamental Rules.

This is the word used by the official side of the anomaly committee during the recent discussion.

Please see the web site http://paycommissionupdate.blogspot.com/2009/12/national-anomaly-committee-meeting-and.html

Anthony
18-12-2009, 09:12 PM
Parimel,

But in Railways, they have clarified that FR-22 still holds good, even after the implementation of the Sixth pay commission. Link (http://www.indianrailways.gov.in/PC/PC6/pc_VI_76.pdf) point No.3

Anthony

tvenkatam
18-12-2009, 09:36 PM
Dear Friends,

Does any one question the validity of FR 22? Mention of FR 22 in para 7 of MACP Scheme of May 2009 with regard to applicability of FR22 (1) (a) (1) for fixation of pay on grant of MACP upgradations is an ample proof for its continued validity.

Anthony
18-12-2009, 09:53 PM
Dear sir,

If FR-22 (Rule 1313 in Railways) holds good, In Railways, Head clerk in a non supervisory post in scale 5000 - 8000, whereas Office Superintendent is a supervisory post in scale 5500 - 9000. When a person is promoted from 5000 scale to 5500 scale, there is assumption of higher responsibilities. If there is assumption of higher responsibilities, according to FR-22 an increment should be given to persons who have been promoted in the merged grades. Am I right sir ?

Anthony

tvenkatam
18-12-2009, 10:10 PM
Dear sir,

If FR-22 (Rule 1313 in Railways) holds good, In Railways, Head clerk in a non supervisory post in scale 5000 - 8000, whereas Office Superintendent is a supervisory post in scale 5500 - 9000. When a person is promoted from 5000 scale to 5500 scale, there is assumption of higher responsibilities. If there is assumption of higher responsibilities, according to FR-22 an increment should be given to persons who have been promoted in the merged grades. Am I right sir ?

Anthony

Dear Mr. Anthony,

Fixation of pay on promotion/ ACP upgradation between merged grades granted between 01.01.2006 and 31.08.2008 must be by raising the basic pay by 3% in the revised pay structure.

svsankar
19-12-2009, 12:41 PM
Dear sir,

If FR-22 (Rule 1313 in Railways) holds good, In Railways, Head clerk in a non supervisory post in scale 5000 - 8000, whereas Office Superintendent is a supervisory post in scale 5500 - 9000. When a person is promoted from 5000 scale to 5500 scale, there is assumption of higher responsibilities. If there is assumption of higher responsibilities, according to FR-22 an increment should be given to persons who have been promoted in the merged grades. Am I right sir ?

Anthony

Dear mr anthony,
Sorry for interruption. In most of the offices Head Clerk(or sometimes Assistant) and Office Superintendent (in Rlys. I believe it is OS II) have been merged and redesignated as Office Superintendent and given the grade pay of 4200. I think this will be done in Railways also.

Anthony
20-12-2009, 06:14 AM
Dear Mr. Shankar,

I would like to clarify that the OS Gr - II post is a Selection post wherein the selection procedure is followed. Merging Head clerk (non selection post) with OS gr - II (selection post) was one of the misconception that has been done especially in Railways. The ministerial staff are the most affected parties in the implementation of the sixth pay commission (including the UDC/LDC). I don't know whether the 5500 - 9000 in other departments is selection post or Non - selection post, but if it is a selection post in other departments, then It is the OS II who are the most affected parties in the Sixth pay commission (those who have been promoted after 01/01/2006).

If FR-22 (Rule 1313 in Railways) holds good, In Railways, Head clerk in a non supervisory post in scale 5000 - 8000, whereas Office Superintendent is a supervisory post in scale 5500 - 9000. When a person is promoted from 5000 scale to 5500 scale, there is assumption of higher responsibilities. If there is assumption of higher responsibilities, according to FR-22 an increment should be given to persons who have been promoted in the merged grades.

Anthony

sa8298
12-01-2010, 04:47 PM
Parimel,

But in Railways, they have clarified that FR-22 still holds good, even after the implementation of the Sixth pay commission. Link (http://www.indianrailways.gov.in/PC/PC6/pc_VI_76.pdf) point No.3

Anthony

FR 22 still holds good. By FR 22 the promoted gets one increment only in the lower grade and not in the higher grade. It is clear from the fact that MACP gives only the next grade pay and not the Pay Band. In case of people in the GP of 2800 next GP of 4200 will be given at the time of MACP but will be given FR 22 benefits in the Pay Band 1 only. Only at the time of actual promotion the incumbent will get the next Pay Band but no FR 22 benefits WILL BE GIVEN AT THE TIME OF ACTUAL PROMOTION AS HE HAS ALREADY AVAILED THE SAME AT THE TIME OF ACP. What is missing as regards FR 22 benefits after the 6 PC scales is the placing of the incumbent in the next above slab of the new scale due to the percentage system of increment introduced by the 6 PC.

In the example referred by Mr. Anthony, I wold like to share his agony and say that the Government has not at all given the normal fixation of the pay in the 5000-8000 to 6500-10500 (revised pay) although it accepts the merger and higher responsibilities etc., where is the question of providing FR 22 benefits. It is an act of Cheat by the Government when it merges the scales with the revised higher pay without even fixing the pay in the revised scale. It does not matter even if the Government had merged the Scales of 5000-8000 with that of 12000 etc., if does not allow the fixation in the revised higher scale of pay.

The government gets the advantage as it can entrus the current duty of the vacant post of 4200 GP (previously with 6500 scales) to a person occupying a post with the same GP 4200 (previously with 5000 scale or 550 scale) without extending him any extra pay for the responsibilities entrusted to him. Hope some one somewhere hears and give justice this lot of poor people who lack representation at all levels.

jitendraacr
12-01-2010, 10:50 PM
Dear friends
FR-22 holds good as on date and no doubt on it. It has not been mentioned any where that this provision hasbeen override. Now, on the query I am to say that FR-22 applies only in case of promotion and not in cases of upgradation or merger of scales. For these two situations, DoP&T have issued clarification way back in ninties and what we get after 6th CPC is based on that. We can not apply FR-22 in cases of merger or upgradation of scales. These are entirely different.
Jitendra

DoToff
08-04-2010, 12:30 PM
Sirs,
giving an increment is only one part of application of FR22.
The next part is to settle it at the next higher stage of the 'higher post'.
How can this part be implemented when the 'stages' in each grades cannot be defined under new 6P rules ?

-DoToff

panchabavimm
14-04-2010, 11:00 AM
Please refer to clarification in OM F.No.1/1/2008-IC dt.13.09.2008, para 2 (clarfication 2)

DoToff
15-04-2010, 01:17 PM
Mr Panchabavimm , Can you pls elaborate further , preferably with an example to show how pay is to be 'settled' at 'next higher post' vide pay fixation under FR22 in 5Pay rules and now under 6Prules ?
-DoTOff

DoToff
04-05-2010, 12:23 PM
Dear Sir,
Can you pls elaborate further ...preferably with an example to show how pay is to be 'settled' at 'next higher post' vide pay fixation under FR22 in 5Pay rules and now under 6Prules ?
-DoTOff

svsankar
04-05-2010, 10:03 PM
FR 22 holds good to the extant it does not contradict with Sixth CPC orders on fixation of pay on promotion etc. In the current system of running pay bands there is no next higher stage hence a benefit of 3% of Pay + GP is granted with an option for the Govt. Servant to draw the promotional benefit either from the date of promotion or from the date of next increment which shall July. In case if the individual opts to get the benefit on the date of promotion. his higher pay will be fixed by granting promotional benefit of 3%(rounding to the next multiple of 10) on the existing Pay + Grade Pay on the day before the date of promotion and the next increment drawn after completing six months of qualifying service. if he opts for date of next increment. on the date of promotion the grade pay of the promoted post shall be granted and on the date of increment. 3% increment as due in the lower post shall be first granted on the pay + grade Pay existing on the date prior to the day of promotion. and then 3% promotional benefit granted on the pay so arrived with the grade pay of the lower post. You can work out examples with the above clarification yourself to get yourself clarified.

R K Rao
04-05-2010, 10:41 PM
Dear Sir,
Can you pls elaborate further ...preferably with an example to show how pay is to be 'settled' at 'next higher post' vide pay fixation under FR22 in 5Pay rules and now under 6Prules ?
-DoTOff

Dear Sirs,

I agree with Mr. Dotoff. Prior to 6CPC, on promotion, one notional increment in the lower grade used to be granted and the pay fixed at the next higher state in the new scale of pay. If the stage happens to be the same, then the next (i.e. an additional increment) stage in the higher scale.

As regards to excercising option for fixation w.r.t. date of increment, this system was there even before. One can excercise the option and as only grade pay is now given for the interim period (date of promotion and DNI), earlier the pay used to be fixed in just next higher stage without any notional increment, for the interim period.

Like present system, on the DNI, pay used to be reverted, granted normal annual increment, a notional increment in the lower grade and then the next higher stage or the next stage in the higher scale.

Whereas in the present system, only 3% is given this way or that way (please do not consider the normal annual increment).

The only solace I think is the sum total of notional increment and higher stage in the new scale seems to be much lesser than the present 3% .

So, Like many, I am still confused, how FR-22 is continues to be applicable for this particular purpose.

[Like may be like Mr. Dotoff, I am also awaiting a illustrated example showing the FR-22 application under the 5CPC and 6CPC].

Regards to all.

RKR

R K Rao
04-05-2010, 10:48 PM
Sorry for a couple of minor mistakes in my earlier posts. The same are corrected here :


Like present system, EARLIER ALSO , on the DNI, pay used to be reverted, granted normal annual increment, a notional increment in the lower grade and then the next higher stage or the next stage in the higher scale.

Whereas in the present system, only 3% is given this way or that way (please do not consider the normal annual increment).

The only solace I think is the sum total of notional increment and higher stage in the HIGHER scale UNDER THE EARLIER CPCs, seems to be much lesser than the present 3% .

svsankar
05-05-2010, 07:16 PM
Dear Sirs,
The benefit of notional increment which was used to be granted earlier on promotion can more particularly described as the sum payable as benefit on promotion (which was equal to one increment)and it was also subject to a minimum of Rs.100- in cases whose increment was lower than that. Now the same benefit has been changed as 3% of the Pay + Grade Pay.
Example:: If in the pre revised an individual drawing pay of Rs. 8500/- is promoted from 6500-200-10500 scale to 7500-250-12000 scale. his benefit on promotion shall be equal to Rs.250/- his pay will be fixed at 8500+200 next stage in 7500/12000 scale Rs.8750/-. In the revised system if a person with gp 4600 promoted to 4800 drawing pay Rs.8500/- his benefit will be (8500+4600)*0.03 which will be equal to Rs.400/-. The benefit of promotion in the prerevised scale of pay will be Rs.250/- and in the new system it will be Rs.400/-.
As per erstwhile pay rules the FR 22 will be read as "an individual on promotion to a higher grade shall be given a promotional benefit equal to one increment in the lower grade and fixed at a stage higher than the notionally arrived pay".
In the new pay rules the FR 22 will be read as " an individual on promotion to a higher grade pay shall be given a promotional benefit equal to 3% of the sum of Pay and Grade Pay of the lower post and the pay so arrived shall be rounded of to the next multiple of ten and the result added to the existing pay and the grade pay of higher post granted"
Ultimately FR 22 deals with the benefit available to a person on promotion. hence FR 22 holds good because the benefit has not been withdrawn only it has been modified to the extant of benefit.

R K Rao
05-05-2010, 07:25 PM
Dear Sirs,
and the pay so arrived shall be rounded of to the next multiple of ten and the result added to the existing pay and the grade pay of higher post granted"


Dear Mr. Shankar,

Thank you for the illustration.

Only a small correction (very insignificant) in your statement is -

you have stated " and the PAY so arrived shall be rounded off" whereas the same should be " and the AMOUNT so arrived shall be rounded off" ( I think).

Thanks again.

RKR

veraich
13-02-2011, 10:31 PM
Sir,

I have read all the queries and explanations given by gconnect members.

I have slight different kind of query, which also pertains to applicability of FR22 in case of appointments. FR22 I a(i) explains fixation of pay on promotion/appointment. (I have started new thread as well:
http://gconnect.in/forums/showthread.php?2052-Pay-fixation-under-6cpc

Brief of my problem is as under:

Whereas the preposistion of granting notional increment for a persons selected to higher GP (say PB-2 GP 4200) from lower posts (say PB-1 GP2800) through open selection is not explained. It was there in pre-revised scales.

What will be pay of persons X drawing pay Rs. 9400 in PB-1 GP 2800 on his selection to PB-2 GP 4200. Will it be:
a) Rs. 9300 plus GP 4200 (as per Section II Part -A CCS (RP) Rules
b) Rs. 9400 plus GP 4200 (simply protection of pay. As there is not issues of equal stages)
c) OR ONE INCREMENT of 3% (Rs. 370) on 9400+2800 will be granted to have pay fixed at 9400+370 in PB-2 plus GP 4200


Pl. guide
Hardeep

Victor
14-02-2011, 03:41 PM
There is confusion at present due to the fact that the whole system of pay scales and fixed increments at every level has been replaced by the new concept of pay bands and grade pays. Consequently, various provisions of FR&SR related to pay etc., have to be suitably modified to bring them in line with the new system of pay bands and grade pays. Only after the DOPT comes out with the amendments to reconcile FR&SR with CCS(RP) Rules, 2008, the confusion will go (I hope).

In the instant case, I feel that the solution to the problem is to give one increment in the case of appointment to another post. This could be subject to the condition that the minimum is at least what is prescribed for direct recruits in Section-II of CCS(RP) Rules, 2008.

Victor

DoToff
11-07-2011, 12:46 PM
Sirs,
Although various examples are given above to demonstrate the implementation of FR22, it shows that the relevance of 'stages ' of the promotion grade does not exist. However the application of FR35 requires that a comparision to be done with the 'next higher stage' applicable to the promotion scale to arrive at a revision figure of the pay. Thus I fail to understand how FR35 can be applied under 6P rules when there is no comparision possible.
can any one pls clarify????